drew sagan

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Posts by drew sagan

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  38

  Unbelievable!! Family member at my leasing office!

  by IronHill in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  ok...i need to vent.

  i just finished writing a letter to my leasing office in regards to my own cousin.

  she is a jw of course, and has lately been less than courteous with us because we are d'ad and i have honestly had enough!

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  drew sagan

  Skully has a good letter, however, I think this part is way over the top:

  "so that we are not further subjected to the psychological abuse of your employee"

  Psychological abuse?
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  38

  Unbelievable!! Family member at my leasing office!

  by IronHill in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  ok...i need to vent.

  i just finished writing a letter to my leasing office in regards to my own cousin.

  she is a jw of course, and has lately been less than courteous with us because we are d'ad and i have honestly had enough!

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  drew sagan

  lol otwo, I suppose we were reading each others minds
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  38

  Unbelievable!! Family member at my leasing office!

  by IronHill in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  ok...i need to vent.

  i just finished writing a letter to my leasing office in regards to my own cousin.

  she is a jw of course, and has lately been less than courteous with us because we are d'ad and i have honestly had enough!

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  drew sagan

  Sorry to be critical, but I think this will help.

  Your letter is far too long, and contains too much information. Most importantly, you need to be more direct.

  First paragraph: Indicate what you are dissatisfied with. You don't want to "address" anything, you want them to address it! Also, do not mention that it is your cousin, as this will bring up concerns regarding family disputes.

  Second paragraph: Detail both occurrences in a very technical manner. No personal details.

  Third paragraph: Your last paragraph is ok (mentioning that you do not want to be a bother is always good), but could probably be a bit shorter. I don't like "on a personal note", it seems too wordy. But that's just me.

  DO NOT MENTION RELIGION! I know you want to, but the fact is that you are due professional courtesy. Don't speculate as to why you have not received it! Bad idea all around as it makes you look bitter and driven by emotion.

  Finally, ask for a response (e.g. I look forward to hearing from you regarding....)

  Sorry to be harsh, but I hope this was helpful.
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  108

  Fight with wife over watching Avatar escalates to near-separation--true story

  by sd-7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it's true because it happened to me last night.

  i knew it was trouble when she started looking at my kindle.

  once she got to the short stories i wrote 3 years ago, autobiographical, some of it involving her, i knew i wouldn't be going to bed before 1:00 (it was 11:40 p.m. by then).

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  drew sagan

  sd-7,

  While I usually stay away from "personal" threads like yours these days, I've been intrigued by a number of your posts. In some ways I suppose you remind me of myself, the good and the bad.

  Your newfound curiosity about the "outside world", while I'm sure very genuine, reveals a person who has been so guarded and confined it is almost hard to imagine. I suppose that later on in life you probably are going to look back at this moment with some embarrassment, realizing how truly underdeveloped you really are. This, at least, is how it has happened for me.

  As I stated in a post in one of your other threads, I think that much of your problems have to do with the issue of mutual support within the marriage. Your wife is not getting the support she feels entitled to (namely, a good JW husband), and instead has to deal with a person that appears openly hostile to her comfortable belief system.

  Do what you feel is right. All I know is that once I realized that my wife needed support (which led to me actually providing it), her own exit from the Watchtower came rather quickly. It also appeared to me to be the right thing to do, regardless of its effects. It's a marriage after all, and compromise should go both ways.
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  150

  Most Ridiculous Thing You've Ever Been Counseled On

  by MrFreeze in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i'm sure topics like this have already come up but they tend to get hilarious with the absolute absurdity that goes on in the kh.

  i was once counseled for not shaving after two days.

  i was also counseled by a sister for eating lucky charms cereal.

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  drew sagan

  A company where I worked carried products with strange and goofy sayings on them (most were very clean, no vulgarity). Eventually this got turned into the Elders, proof that I was peddling filth .

  I also got counseled by a very old Elder who was angry about the fact that my wife didn't turn her time slip in promptly at the end of the month. "A man should be in charge of his wife, Drew, now make sure you get her back in like ok?"

  Glad to be done with that!
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  24

  Reasoning from the Scripture book and new light on generation don't add up

  by wasblind in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  everyone listen up if you still have your" reasoning from the scriptures" book get them out turn to page 234 and read the last sentence in the definition.

  where it says: the generation who was alive in 1914 would be the generation to see the end.

  then turn to page 242 on the top of the page where they say it's not gonna be another generation to experience this.

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  drew sagan

  cult classic, you should have done what some jws did, have the Reasoning book bound in the back of their NWT then it looked like they were reading from the bible.

  Too funny!

  I remember one JW girl who kept going on and on about how she wanted one of those. I was on my way out of the org and really didn't care about what I said.

  I told her she never would use it and that it was a waste of time and money. She replied that with a generic reply: "but it will be helpful in the field!"

  I then told her that she probably never even used the reasoning book out in service and if she did please name the occurance.

  Complete silence followed...
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  260

  Who Are Your Past Circuit Overseers? It's a small world..

  by mentallyfree31 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  who were your past circuit overseers?

  i'm sure a lot of us actually know mutual people, as the co's relocate all over the country.. here's a few from the southeast us: (let me know if you recognize any names and post yours too please...).

  ellwood johnson (new york/philadelphia area for several years also).

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  drew sagan

  I was in the Pittsburgh area, only for a short time (98-07). Here is all the CO's I had:

  Fred Lanier (Laneer?) - Big fellow, rather friendly. My bible study conductor brought him over my house before I was baptized.

  Norman Mosher (Moser?) - Older widow, used to be a school teacher. He instructed my pioneer school. Very friendly and accessible.

  Richard Leighton - This guy really liked to make life miserable. I was a MS during his visits. Would really tell everybody off, complain about how lazy they were, ect. He was really stuck in a 50s mentality, subjection of women, etc. Never really talked to him much other than going out in service a few times. His talks would mainly complain that things "used to be better." Lots of stories about how out there this guy was.

  Favorite quote during a public talk, used to tell us how close we are to "the end":

  "They used to make school buildings tall, and they were cheap to heat, and kids got lots up exercise going up and down the stairs. Now they make school buildings long, and kids don't get enough exercise, and they are more expensive to heat."

  I also remember him reading a poem that was probably written back in the early 1980s. It complained that "things are different from the good ol' days." One specific line:

  "I remember when a rabbit was a rabbit, and not a car"

  This was before the VW rabbit was reissued a few years back. Somehow he needed to complain about the name of the car 20 years after it had stopped being made.

  Of course he also gave that infamous CO talk about people having sex with animals (05, 06?).

  I also remember John Crispin was the DO for a while. I believe he was from California. There was another DO, guy was bald, told terrible jokes (including a cheap pun that related to his name somehow). Can't remember him...
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  24

  Reasoning from the Scripture book and new light on generation don't add up

  by wasblind in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  everyone listen up if you still have your" reasoning from the scriptures" book get them out turn to page 234 and read the last sentence in the definition.

  where it says: the generation who was alive in 1914 would be the generation to see the end.

  then turn to page 242 on the top of the page where they say it's not gonna be another generation to experience this.

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  drew sagan

  I would imagine that a new Reasoning book has already been under development for some time.
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  44

  Incoming communication from Borg elder

  by sd-7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i guess it's about time to post on what happened over the weekend.

  i was telling my old pal jamiebowers about it and she thought it was hilarious.

  thought i might retell the tale on a thread of its own.. so, i dropped my wife off at the kh for her cult recruitment activities.

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  drew sagan

  As others have said, you need to stop beating yourself up.

  I've read through a number of your other posts and one theme that seems to keep coming up is that you consistently second guess your decision to question the organization, even believing that things may be better in your life if you never started an exit process, or even decided to go back.

  For example:

  I almost felt, to quote Wolverine, that I could "give these geeks one more try." But of course, I did just hang up on the chairman of my JC. Even if I wanted to go back, it'd be two years of perfect attendance before I'd even have a chance. But then, why the h*** would I go back? I'm out. My wife is still gonna treat me like crap if I go back--she might like me more temporarily, but I've been through that already, no point in getting my hopes up about it.

  Exiting the Watchtower, both physically and mentally, can take years. I was officially DF'd in 2007. Since then I have made some major life changes and finally finished college this past year. Three years to get my life moving on a different trajectory. I used to feel that my JW experience defined who I was, but now I am finally able to move on from that past life without having to think about it.

  About your wife.

  More than anything, she is probably fearful and resentful. Understand these emotions because they have nothing to do with the correctness of doctrines!

  She is fearful because she is now married to a person who no longer accepts "the truth." You are against god and everything she has ever been told. This is a grave threat to the perceived security the Watchtower provides to her.

  She is probably resentful because in a sense you have left her out to dry. When I first decided to stop attending meetings the first thing my wife did was feel anger that I was "leaving her", so to speak. She had to go to the meetings without me, which was a humiliating thing. My wife once put it this way (after she exited the WT):

  "The Witnesses provide no form of mobility for women. There are no special positions, appointments, or other opportunities that are afforded to men. As a women, the most important decision you can make as a witness is your marriage mate. That is it. Choose well and you will tag along with the perfect theocratic man and all of his accomplishments. Make the wrong choice and you are a loser"

  For your wife, as it was for my wife, every day she has a husband that stays away from "the truth" she is reminded that she made the wrong choice in regards to the most important decision she could make.

  I quickly understood what was happening and decided not to let my wife go it alone. I went back to meetings with her and we supported each other. She eventually came to see that it wasn't the truth. We both exited together within a year. Support is important!

  Since I was in pretty much the same situation I could speak forever on this. PM me if you want to chat. Otherwise, good luck!
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  13

  The likes of Ehrman and Friedman

  by dgp in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  after reading about his book on this forum, i got the book who wrote the bible, by richard elliott friedman.

  i had also bought several other books by bart ehrman, and then one by bruce metzger, the canon of the bible.

  i haven't read them all yet, but what i have read is enough for me to ask yet another question here.

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  drew sagan

  The Jehovah's Witnesses are a social organization. The Watchtower's leadership is mainly interested in preserving, expanding, and protecting the organizational structure they have inherited. Detailed study of the bible, ancient history, science or anything else dose not help much in this regard.